This Weekend's Big East Games

[MU/Panther]

Saturday 12/5:
11:00 - Seton Hall @ Rutgers, ESPNEWS - Mike Corey, Craig Robinson
11:00 - Indiana State @ Butler, FS1 - Justin Kutcher, Nick Bahe
12:00 - 14 Syracuse @ Georgetown, FOX - Tim Brando, Jim Jackson
1:00 - Chicago State @ DePaul, FS1 - Aaron Goldsmith, Stephen Bardo
1:00- Creighton @ Loyola, espn3
1:30 - Maine @ Marquette, FSN - Vince Welsh, Dickey Simpkins
6:00 - 23 Providence @ Rhode Island, ESPNU - Kevin Fitzgerald, Tim Welsh
7:30 - Western Kentucky @ 12 Xavier, FS1 - Steve Physioc, Tarik Turner

Sunday 12/6:
10:00AM - Saint Francis Bklyn. @ St. John's, FS1 - Jason Knapp, Ron Thompson

[MU/Panther]

Maine @ Marquette on FSN
TV: FS Wisconsin, FS Arizona, FS Detroit, FS Florida, FS Midwest, FS North, FS Ohio, FS Southeast, FS Southwest, Prime Ticket, MASN2, MSG Network, COX Sports Northeast, WCUU Chicago

[DCwarrior]

Outside of the G'Town and Providence games, a bunch of truly crappy buy games. I guess Rutgers technically counts as a Power 5 conference team.

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

Outside of the G'Town and Providence games, a bunch of truly crappy buy games. I guess Rutgers technically counts as a Power 5 conference team.

Buy games, but not all crappy buy games. Western Kentucky and Indiana State are decent mid-majors, with WKU a team that should be top half of C-USA and ISU a mid-level MVC team. Creighton's road game at Loyola is also a decent game, with the Jays only -2.5 according to Vegas.

I looked at all the opponents of the Big East teams on RPI Forecast yesterday, and only one Big East team has more than two teams that project to be sub-300 RPI teams on the schedule. Of course, that one team is Marquette with six.

[CaribouJim]

Buy games, but not all crappy buy games. Western Kentucky and Indiana State are decent mid-majors, with WKU a team that should be top half of C-USA and ISU a mid-level MVC team. Creighton's road game at Loyola is also a decent game, with the Jays only -2.5 according to Vegas.

I looked at all the opponents of the Big East teams on RPI Forecast yesterday, and only one Big East team has more than two teams that project to be sub-300 RPI teams on the schedule. Of course, that one team is Marquette with six.

I do like that Loyola game - if I wasn't going to Milwaukee, I would have considered swinging by that game.

Ouch on your RPI analysis. I'm going to be nice and say that this year's schedule is an anomaly and we won't see anything like it again. Beyond pathetic. Some of the rationalization on this year's schedule has been pretty pathetic too.

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

I sincerely hope you're right. I look around the league and really feel that everyone did a good job of minimizing the truly terrible RPI teams this year. Butler does have three teams on their schedule currently in the 280-299 range while Creighton has two in the 290-299 range, so there are some potential stinkers out there, but as a league, there seemed to be a focus on minimizing the really bad teams. If RPI factors as usual come Selection Sunday, that should bode well for the Big East, but where it worries me is if there is a glut of teams in the 9-9 to 11-7 range and we're one of them, we could be the odd team out.

If 'Nova dominates again, goes 16-2, and we've got three teams that are all bad, say St. John's and DePaul 2-16 and Seton Hall 4-14, that would give us an additional 6 teams averaging 11-7. I don't think that's at all impossible, but would they take 7 teams from the Big East? Selection Sunday is a long way off, but if there are 6 teams separated by 2-3 games, this non-con schedule could really bite us.

[MKE_GoldenEagleFan]

I do like that Loyola game - if I wasn't going to Milwaukee, I would have considered swinging by that game.

Ouch on your RPI analysis. I'm going to be nice and say that this year's schedule is an anomaly and we won't see anything like it again. Beyond pathetic. Some of the rationalization on this year's schedule has been pretty pathetic too.

If MU gets left out of the tournament because of non conference schedule that will fix it... That or if attendance dips enough.

[kneelb4zerg]

I sincerely hope you're right. I look around the league and really feel that everyone did a good job of minimizing the truly terrible RPI teams this year. Butler does have three teams on their schedule currently in the 280-299 range while Creighton has two in the 290-299 range, so there are some potential stinkers out there, but as a league, there seemed to be a focus on minimizing the really bad teams. If RPI factors as usual come Selection Sunday, that should bode well for the Big East, but where it worries me is if there is a glut of teams in the 9-9 to 11-7 range and we're one of them, we could be the odd team out.

If 'Nova dominates again, goes 16-2, and we've got three teams that are all bad, say St. John's and DePaul 2-16 and Seton Hall 4-14, that would give us an additional 6 teams averaging 11-7. I don't think that's at all impossible, but would they take 7 teams from the Big East? Selection Sunday is a long way off, but if there are 6 teams separated by 2-3 games, this non-con schedule could really bite us.

Blah ******* blah.

[warriorfan4life]

I hope and actually think that Georgetown pounds Cuse. The Hoyas have been really good this year save for the Radford debacle, and a big win for them would help vault them back into the national spotlight (and I think they're still the third best team in the league).

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

Providence/Rhode Island should be interesting as well. Good game, though not sure RI will be the contender they were expected to be in the A-10 with EC Matthews out for the year. This is probably their last shot at a top-50 non-conference win. Hope Dunn and company can steal this on the road, won't be easy, but is winnable.

[79warrior]

If MU gets left out of the tournament because of non conference schedule that will fix it... That or if attendance dips enough.

Based on how empty the BC looks it appears attendance is down. It would not take a genius to know going in the schedule is laughable.

[TedBaxter]

I'm going to be real, real honest about Marquette attendance. The fans have been spoiled over the past 45-50 years and every time there's a coaching change with a rebuilding aspect to the program, you have the 10,000-11,000 regulars who keep their tickets and the 3,000-4,000 bandwagoneers wait until the team is good again before they re up.

The people who really back the program and understand what is being built are at the Bradley Center or watching games without complaining about the schedule.

[MayorBeluga]

The people who really back the program and understand what is being built are at the Bradley Center or watching games without complaining about the schedule.

Really Ted? Come on. There are large numbers of us who have had tickers for years, truly back the program and attend virtually every game and understand it's a transition year but still think the home non-con schedule is beyond pathetic. I'm out of town this weekend and had a hell of a time giving the tickets away for free. I understand the need for home game revenue as well as by games. I understand it's an incredibly young team. But asking me to pay for SIX sub-300 games is awful.

[Nukem2]

Yeah, that's about it. I'm there every game (though I did miss the Grambling game Wed. due to cataract surgery, but I will be back today). Have to understand as you say. Though, to be honest, the NC home schedule could have been somewhat better. But, it is the schedule. Such is life. Lets go Warriors!

[TedBaxter]

That's me your Honor. My high school didn't win a game for 2 1/2 years and my parents still took me to every home and away game despite those lean years. When the times were good, I saw people I never saw before. It will be the same way next year going forward with Marquette.

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

Based on how empty the BC looks it appears attendance is down. It would not take a genius to know going in the schedule is laughable.

I broke down some numbers because this angle of looking at things seems interesting and a bit different:

I've been wondering how much butts in seats matters to them right now. The announced attendance for Grambling was 11,618, which is obviously sold seats because from being there, I'd guess there weren't half that many people. The lower bowl was maybe 40-50% full and the upper deck was probably 90% empty. Obviously they get the ticket sales revenue, but how much does MU get for concessions and that such? Average attendance was over 15,000 from 2006-07 until 2013-14, but last year dipped well down to 13,657.

This year, the high-water mark is lower than last year's average with 13,297 seats being sold for the Iowa game. The only other game over 12,000 was the opener with Belmont and the average right now is 12,181. Figure it has to go up from there with Big East play still to come, but if the remaining non-con home games are all announced at 12,000 or less and the actual butts in seats is around half that, they would have to be leaving a ton of revenue in the living rooms. It seemed for years our attendance was a big point of pride, so does that make these numbers a point of shame for the athletic department, or are they happy because they have all the extra home dates?

Two years ago when we were winning, we played both Grambling and IUPUI. Then we drew 13,372 (Tues) to Grambling vs 11,618 (Weds) this year and for IUPUI drew 13,972 (Sat) vs 11,597 (Mon). But what really stood out was that we drew 13,668 on a Tuesday for 2-5 Ball State. So we drew more for BSU on a Tuesday than we did this year for the Friday night season opener (Belmont - 12,628), our marquee non-con game (Iowa - 13,297), and our best weekend tally (Jackson State - 11,764). I'd also wager all of those 2013 games had a higher percentage of butts in seats than any of the games this year save maybe Iowa, largely thanks to Black and Yellow in the crowd.

Even looking at last year, we drew more for cupcakes. The cupcake average this year (including the Belmont opener, since everyone says fans can't tell the difference between Belmont and Grambling) is 11,902 through 4 games, down from last year's 12,536 (not including Alabama A&M at the Al). If you factor in AAMU, the average last year was 10,960 for 6 games. However, those 6 games only accounted for 35.3% of the schedule, whereas this year the cupcake games account for 47.4% of the schedule (9/19 games, again including Belmont). If you assume the same average Big East attendance as last year, which was 15,010, this year's average attendance would be DOWN from 2014-15 because of the sheer quantity of cupcakes and the lessening attendance in those games despite not having the anchor of playing a game at the Al.

Last year we averaged 13,657, which was 22nd in the NCAAs. This year, if we continue to average 11,902 in cupcake games and match our 15,010 in Big East games from a year ago, we will average 13,412 tickets sold per game. Our point of pride of always ranking top-15 in the country in attendance dropped last year to top-25, and could fall out of the top-25 if Big East sales don't match last year (cupcakes are already down despite a better record, why wouldn't Big East sales also drop?).

[MKE_GoldenEagleFan]

Even if you go beyond the money, the coaching staff doesn't want a mostly empty arena for recruiting purposes. It just does not look good for the university as a whole. Now with that said, it's not just the schedule, it also has to do with how we finished the last few years. Start winning and butts will start getting in those searts.

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

Even if you go beyond the money, the coaching staff doesn't want a mostly empty arena for recruiting purposes. It just does not look good for the university as a whole. Now with that said, it's not just the schedule, it also has to do with how we finished the last few years. Start winning and butts will start getting in those searts.

It will definitely help. While I know Iowa isn't a regular rival, seeing 13,297 sold to that is a tough number to swallow. I really hope we do better come Big East time.

One more reason why getting back to the tournament this year would be huge, to reinvigorate excitement and help bring people back next year. It'd be really nice to have 2-3 seasons of winning teams with NCAA berths going into the new arena. We'll get a boost from it opening, but we'll sustain it by winning.

[MU/Panther]

Butler 48 Indiana State 43, on FS1

[kneelb4zerg]

wojo commented about the schedule today, saying it isn't made in a bubble. Schedule haters need to get out of their bubble.
http://m.jsonline.com/sports/goldeneagles/as-competition-has-dropped-off-marquettes-play-hasnt-b99628266z1-360636611.html

[MU/Panther]

10 to 2 Georgetown run on FOX. 18 to 10 Georgetown over Syracuse.

[Markedman]

Seton Hall destroying Rutgers....74-49

[milkbone]

Loyola beats Creighton 68-65

[MU/Panther]

I watch the final 30 seconds of Creighton at Loyola at the Bradley Center and Creighton had about 4 chances and two missed free-throws to tie it at the end or take the lead in the final 14 seconds.

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

wojo commented about the schedule today, saying it isn't made in a bubble. Schedule haters need to get out of their bubble.
http://m.jsonline.com/sports/goldeneagles/as-competition-has-dropped-off-marquettes-play-hasnt-b99628266z1-360636611.html

Blah ******* blah.

As I noted elsewhere, most of these teams have been bad for the past five years. Even if you don't know the makeup of your team, you know the general quality of these opponents. This isn't just about Marquette, but scheduling league-wide. Every team MU schedules impacts every other team in the league. These things aren't done in a bubble.

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

I watch the final 30 seconds of Creighton at Loyola at the Bradley Center and Creighton had about 4 chances and two missed free-throws to tie it at the end or take the lead in the final 14 seconds.

I feel like Creighton is going to be that team that wins 7 or 8 Big East games, and in the process possibly costs the league a bid or two because they're just good enough to trip up bubble teams at the wrong time.

[Markedman]

Watching Milwaukee native Jarvis Garrett play for Rhode Island vs Providence. He has been impressive. I know Buzz looked at him.....not sure if he offered or not. Good looking Soph point guard.

[kneelb4zerg]

Blah ******* blah.

As I noted elsewhere, most of these teams have been bad for the past five years. Even if you don't know the makeup of your team, you know the general quality of these opponents. This isn't just about Marquette, but scheduling league-wide. Every team MU schedules impacts every other team in the league. These things aren't done in a bubble.

Lol. I think you don't like the result but have no clue about the true logistics of putting together a schedule. But please proceed as if you are as smart as you think you are.

[MU/Panther]

Providence 74 Rhode Island 72
Ben Bentil with the tip-in at the buzzer! Great in state rivals.

[MUwarrior1090]

Didn't want to make a new thread so thought I'd throw it in here.

Arizona State up 33-19 over #18 TAMU at halftime. Would be a nice little boost for MU if they could hold on. TAMU is 7-1 with wins over Texas and Gonzaga.

[Markedman]

ASU looking good against the 18th ranked team in the country

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

Lol. I think you don't like the result but have no clue about the true logistics of putting together a schedule. But please proceed as if you are as smart as you think you are.

I think we can and have done better. The rest of the Big East clearly can and did do better. I don't like the results and feel some of the answers are full of cop-outs and contradictions. I'm a big fan of honesty. If they are going to put out a weak schedule deliberately, and there is absolutely zero doubt in my mind that this was a deliberately bad schedule, I'd like some ownership of that. Instead, we get "scheduling at the BC is hard, predicting who will be good is hard, getting games coming off a 13-win season is hard." If they picked bad teams to help their young team learn how to win, fine, own it and admit it. If they picked bad teams because they did a bad job of predicting outcomes, fine, own it and admit it. But all we hear are excuses and rationalizations. As a loyal, paying customer, I'd like an explanation that isn't blatant smokescreen and misdirection the second it rolls off the tongue.

[MUAlphaBangura]

Arizona State beats #18 Texas A&M 67-54. Every little bit helps.

[TheSultan]

I think we can and have done better. The rest of the Big East clearly can and did do better. I don't like the results and feel some of the answers are full of cop-outs and contradictions. I'm a big fan of honesty. If they are going to put out a weak schedule deliberately, and there is absolutely zero doubt in my mind that this was a deliberately bad schedule, I'd like some ownership of that. Instead, we get "scheduling at the BC is hard, predicting who will be good is hard, getting games coming off a 13-win season is hard." If they picked bad teams to help their young team learn how to win, fine, own it and admit it. If they picked bad teams because they did a bad job of predicting outcomes, fine, own it and admit it. But all we hear are excuses and rationalizations. As a loyal, paying customer, I'd like an explanation that isn't blatant smokescreen and misdirection the second it rolls off the tongue.


Do you really think Marquette is going to come out and denigrate their opponents in such a manner? There is absolutely no way that Marquette is going to acknowledge that they intentionally scheduled weaker opponents to teach a younger team to win. Matty V. insinuated that was the case, and my guess is someone told him that "off the record."

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

Do you really think Marquette is going to come out and denigrate their opponents in such a manner? There is absolutely no way that Marquette is going to acknowledge that they intentionally scheduled weaker opponents to teach a younger team to win. Matty V. insinuated that was the case, and my guess is someone told him that "off the record."

They could acknowledge the lack of home and home series, neutral court games, and the two or three for one scenarios we've seen with the likes of Milwaukee and Green Bay in the past without denigrating anyone.

[pbiflyer]

Do you really think Marquette is going to come out and denigrate their opponents in such a manner? There is absolutely no way that Marquette is going to acknowledge that they intentionally scheduled weaker opponents to teach a younger team to win. Matty V. insinuated that was the case, and my guess is someone told him that "off the record."

Murph would be proud of the dogged pursuit of a complaint/point (Not referring to you Sultan).

[TheSultan]

They could acknowledge the lack of home and home series, neutral court games, and the two or three for one scenarios we've seen with the likes of Milwaukee and Green Bay in the past without denigrating anyone.


I just think the idea that Marquette is going to acknowledge any mistake about their schedule is fanciful. Marquette has very likely heard this complaint loud and clear by many connected to the program. My guess is that you will see a difference next year. If not, it shows that customer and donor complaints aren't being taken into consideration, or at least they aren't weighted as important enough when compared to other factors. (Need $$ for home dates...Wojo desire to pump up the W/L record...)

But continuing to complain about this schedule doesn't do anything. Any expectation of a mea culpa from Marquette is unrealistic.

[MU/Panther]

19 to 2 run for St. John's to close the 1st half.
St. John's 40 St. Francis Brooklyn 34, 16:25 left, on FS1