An amazing Buzz stat

[Nukem2]

Given the way Buzz used stats, this one really stands out. No player recruited by Buzz as a head coach played for Buzz for 4 seasons during his 6 year tenure. Granted he was the recruiting assistant for Otule who played for Buzz for all 6 seasons, but...that is rather amazing.

[TheSultan]

Davante Gardner, Junior Cadougan... But yeah I think those are the only two.

[Nukem2]

Davante Gardner, Junior Cadougan... But yeah I think those are the only two.Brain fade...:p But, still.

[TheSultan]

Put it this way. The following eight players were recruited by Buzz, had four years of eligibility, and could have finished that by the end of this year. Of these players, only two (Cadougan and Gardner) played all four years for Buzz.

Maymon
Mbao
E. Williams
Cadougan
R. Smith
J. Jones
Blue
Gardner

Two of these players transferred midway through their first year. One transferred after his first year. Two transferred after their second year. One turned pro after his third.

[IWB]

While he didn't go to MU right off the bat, Jamil Wilson was recruited by Buzz (after he was released by Oregon) and was in the program for four years under Buzz.

Kind of an unfair stat as there are only two classes that qualified. They won't have played all four years under Buzz, but Derrick, Juan and Mayo will all be four year players that Buzz recruited.

Also, Erik Williams committed to MU under Crean.

[Nukem2]

While he didn't go to MU right off the bat, Jamil Wilson was recruited by Buzz (after he was released by Oregon) and was in the program for four years under Buzz.

Kind of an unfair stat as there are only two classes that qualified. They won't have played all four years under Buzz, but Derrick, Juan and Mayo will all be four year players that Buzz recruited.

Also, Erik Williams committed to MU under Crean.The criteria was playing for Buzz for 4 years. Jamil was a transfer. Transfers, in both directions, were a big reason Buzz did not have more 4 year guys. Not trying to criticize Buzz, just analyzing stats.

[IWB]

Just pointing out that Jamil played for Buzz for four years, but he was only eligible.

Also pointing out that, despite being at MU for 6 years, only two classes of players qualify. So despite the high number of transfers out, it's not like we are looking T "6 years worth of guys".

[BLT]

Buzz was gone before Gardner and Jamil actually graduated, so only Junior technically made it from cradle to grave.

[IWB]

But he was there until they finished their eligibility.

[Nukem2]

In the final analysis, Buzz's successes were firmly founded on transfers of various kinds as well as the "leftovers" from TC. Wojo is now in a similar position with Buzz's leftovers (including Sandy and Nick) as wel as transfers (Matt, Gabe and Wally). These guys will tell the tale of Wojo's success over the next few years. We shall see how things unfold.

[Markedman]

I don’t view Nick as a “Buzz leftover”. Obviously he fist committed under Buzz but he reopened and allowed himself to be recruited by other schools…Wojo had to close him all over again…and did.

Sandy never reopened and was a senior so I guess he could fall into that category.

[Nukem2]

I don’t view Nick as a “Buzz leftover”. Obviously he fist committed under Buzz but he reopened and allowed himself to be recruited by other schools…Wojo had to close him all over again…and did.

Sandy never reopened and was a senior so I guess he could fall into that category.For this purpose I would disagree. Great that Wojo was able to keep these guys in the fold. But they are in-state guys who have a greater tie-in to MU than would Hill, Pierce or Shayok.

[BLT]

But he was there until they finished their eligibility.

The internet has its flaws in that it is too literal. Buzz is absolutely my favorite MU coach since Al. And that covers some fine individuals. That said, Buzz left those kids at the altar. Senior year was not good for them including the last weekend.

[Gato78]

Begs the question: who do you prefer, Crean or Buzz? I have to go with Crean at this point.

[Nukem2]

Begs the question: who do you prefer, Crean or Buzz? I have to go with Crean at this point.Tough question. Buzz was more successful overall, Crean's Final 4 notwithstanding. Crean's tenure was definitely more fan/student friendly. Hard pick, but Buzz was rather above the masses his last two years. Thogh TC was rather aloof as well. A tie in my book. We move on to Wojo.

[MUAlphaBangura]

Begs the question: who do you prefer, Crean or Buzz? I have to go with Crean at this point.

Coach Crean all day long.

[Gato78]

Though TC had some shortcomings, especially his departure, he has never trashed Marquette. Buzz trashed the conference , TV package and administration. I think Buzz has helped TC gain some of his lost respect, much like the Kevin O'Neil fan opinions changed over time. At the Cords HOF induction, KO was received with open arms. TC may be in that position in the future with a couple savvy pro-Marquette statements. Buzz has some work to do.

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

Begs the question: who do you prefer, Crean or Buzz? I have to go with Crean at this point.

Had you told me a year ago that my answer would be Crean and it wasn't close I wouldn't have believed it. I have been okay with TC for awhile, felt the time to let it go was long since past, but I bought into Buzz's schtick maybe a bit too much. I was disappointed, but could accept him leaving. His actions since, not so much.

It will be interesting to see the reaction of the students during next year's Remember the Titans video. Will the boos for Crean still be as loud? Will boos for Buzz (if he's in the video) be even louder?

[Nukem2]

Time to move on. Both dissed us/MU/administration in their own ways. But, both brought a lot to MU. Enjoy what they brought and support Wojo for our future (whatever that might be). Nothing is forever. Suspect that many of us have moved on numerous times in our careers for whatever reasons. Peace.

[MUBasketball]

Coach Crean all day long.

Had a feeling that would be your choice! ;)

[TheSultan]

I think Buzz was the better coach....but in the end Crean had more class.

[Markedman]

I think Buzz was the better coach....but in the end Crean had more class.

I agree with this……..

[MUAlphaBangura]

I guess it depends on what someone considers to be the overall product of a coach. If you are looking at x's and o's, I would give the edge to Brent. But Coach Crean had his moments as far as that goes. The rest, Crean in a landslide. Building the program. Promoting it. Working to get the student body involved. I think our student participation has dwindled significantly under Brent. All the PR aspects of being a coach. Building a culture for your program-- look what kind of culture Crean left Brent, and look what kind of culture Brent left Wojo. All we are talking about lately are guys that are not committed to the program. We never said that about the amigos or Zar. And,as mentioned, Coach Crean to date, has never had a bad word for anything Marquette related. Total class(except how his leaving played out) compared to Brent.

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

Buzz was also a better and more consistent recruiter than Crean. Though he did seem to focus too much on recruiting rankings at times, certainly early on (E-Will and Mello).

[Gato78]

I think both were and are good men who had their priorities in order. I think they were also like Shakespearean characters where the various vices of the human experience interfered with their good judgment from time to time. Whether ego, greed, narcissism, whatever, both men had occasional issues around the Al that denigrated their good reputations. Yet, they were both religious and did many good deeds. Buzz was better X's and O's. Crean was a better representative of the University. Both were good recruiters in very different ways. Buzz was somewhat mercurial but could be fun. TC was less interesting but more stable. Crean was more social, Buzz tended to stay away from social situations. Both were incredibly focused. It will be interesting to see how Wojo's tenure goes with the recent experiences of Buzz and TC in mind. BTW Crean should be in the next Hall of Fame class at MU as an individual based on his accomplishments. Not sure yet if Buzz deserves that--needs to be measured as time passes.

[2013UnleashTheBeast]

I absolutely hated all of last year. But for me it's Buzz in a landslide. The first 5 years were exactly what I want out of an MU coach. Can't tell whether he's insane or not, the dances after DJO's putback and WVU, the GTST mentality, giving unsung JUCOs a chance to shine on a big stage, a hungry underdog mentality, the midgets team, stealing Vander from UW.... The list goes on. Crean had no personality, he was basically a corporate automaton with a whistle, and his coaching was average IMO.

[CaribouJim]

Buzz's first 5 years was the best, other than Al's tenure, 5 year run at MU. Leaving out the 6th year meltdown, I thought he was a far superior game coach to TC. As far as recruiting, more of a close call - TC recruited the big 3, one being the best MU player ever, that lead to a FF and also the 3 Amigos with one being more than solid contributor in the NBA for 5 seasons now. Buzz went a more untraditional route in his recruiting that included landing the eventual BE POY and was responsible for developing Jimmy Butler, 2nd team All-Defense this year. Again, pretty much a coin flip on recruiting.

As far as marketing the program, other than wins, no contest - TC. Took over a program trajectory that was heading south, jumped in and got into the dorms to get the frosh and sophs to reinvest in the program. He was awesome at the annual pre-season coaches' luncheon in Chicago - the last few years at the Union League Club. Gave great recaps for each and every player and was kind of an co- host MC. On the contrary, Buzz was not very comfortable in that role and didn't seem prepared. The first one he did ended really early as he didn't have much to say. The next year it was a post season event and then disappeared altogether. Glad to hear that it will be coming back this year. Really fun event and there are a ton of us that make that Chicago to Milwaukee trek and back each home game so we kind of felt dissed when it was discontinued.

Ultimately, MU was lucky to have both for those 15 years - smooth tranistion to the best confernce ever (IMO) in college b-ball with never a losing season, a share of the BE crown, a FF, an Elite 8 and 2 Sweet 16's ( I don't double dip when counting Sweet 16's). MU is now solidly back into the national scene and I expect Wojo will keep us there.