To All the Blue & Gold Sunglass Wearers

[Phantom Warrior]

All summer and fall I've been reading all these pie-in-the-sky posts about how Mayo was going to have a break-out season, how Jamil was going to take the next step and be our latest Lazar, Jimmy, Jae, how Derrick will be better offensively, how Jake's shooting will improve, how Juan is finally healthy and will be a solid contributor, blah, blah, blah.

Well, we saw the realities today.

Todd will not make us forget Vander.

Jamil is not ready to take the next step.

Derrick has not improved offensively.

Jake still can't find the basket in a real game.

Juan is still extremely limited on the offensive end.

But what truly disappoints me is that Buzz did not give Dawson or Johnson a chance to help, and Burton got only a couple of minutes (and brought some energy and attitude).

In short, I am disappointed in Buzz. Unless Johnson and Dawson were ill or injured or broke some team rules or something.

Let's face the facts:

Derrick is not a high-major starter as a point guard - a decent back-up, but if he's going to play 35-40 mpg, we are in serious trouble.

Jake is not a high-major starter; at best he should get a couple of minutes a game.

Jamil is not an all-conference-level player, not even close.

Todd is not a high-major starter.

Juan is little more than a limited high-energy guy off the bench.

There were a few possessions when we had Derrick, Jake, Todd, Juan, and Chris on the floor together. Yikes.

If Buzz is going to sit the frosh like he did today, this is going to be a very, very, long year.

[TheSultan]

What makes you believe the freshmen are any better?

Not to mention that I don't agree with your pessimism either. But I guess that makes me a "blue and gold sunglass wearer." :rolleyes:

[warriorfan4life]

After five years and three consecutive trips to the second weekend of the tourney, you would think that intelligent fans would trust Buzz and his method of preparing teams for the season long marathon. Of course, many fans were incredibly critical of Al freaking McGuire during his tenure, the same man who led Marquette to the second best record in the 70's. I think Buzz is a modern day Al, and has us on cusp of a modern day equivalent to that run.

Last year in November, Florida massacred us on both ends if the floor. We were good enough defensively to win today, but a great OSU defense overwhelmed our retooling offense. I doubted Buzz and the team last year, and never liked how the pieces fit together. Yet Buzz still managed to win a Big East title and get to the Elite 8 with that group. I like how the parts of this team can potentially fit together. Has not happened yet offensively, but I think they will.

[kneelb4zerg]

Yeah, and to all the people ready to jump ship on this team before thanksgiving, please please come back and eat all kinds of ****.

We get these kind of woe is us posts every year after bad losses -- I haven't even checked in on whatever inanity is happening at the other sites -- but how have people not learned to trust Buzz's coaching ability by now?

[MUMac]

One game against an experienced squad is not enough for me to agree with your post. MU was expected to be a work in progress during the non-conference play. They had a bad game. A few shots drop early and who knows. It was obvious to me that many of the players you mentioned and were critical of were pressing due to the shots not falling.

You can write them off, as is your want. You can call those of us who do not subscribe to your negativity (you will likely call it realism - to which that is another thing I will not agree with you), as is your want. I am guessing the team learns from this debacle. They did with each of the others they experienced in the past few years.

[Phantom Warrior]

One of the things I can't stand about some of the Badger Lunatics is there "Bo is god/Bo can do no wrong" nonsense. Bo is an excellent coach who has had amazing results. But how dare anyone criticize Bo on one of those Badger boards? Sorry, Bo isn't perfect. He has flaws just like every other coach does.

Guess what. The same is true of Buzz. I respect Buzz as a coach. He has earned every MU fan's respect, appreciation, and gratitude. But Buzz is not perfect. Buzz is not above criticism. And if this board ever embraces the kind of reverent adulation for Buzz that Badger boards do for Bo, then this site will become as offensive as those Badger boards are.

I do not think the season is over, by any means. But today was the perfect opportunity to give Johnson and Dawson some decent minutes in the second half. We looked awful. We played awful. We were down by double digits and going nowhere.

The freshmen should have been given a chance. I'd rather lose by 25 and have them gain some experience against top-quality competition than lose by 17 and have them sit on the bench the entire game. And yes, I think Buzz made a mistake by not playing them at all. If he plays them only against the Gramblings and Southerns, when are they going to get the experience needed when we play New Mexico, Wisconsin, and Big East competition?

And I do honestly believe that if Derrick and Jake get the kind of minutes they had today the remainder of the season, we are in trouble.

[DavidBoone2inchesTaller]

One of the things I can't stand about some of the Badger Lunatics is there "Bo is god/Bo can do no wrong" nonsense. Bo is an excellent coach who has had amazing results. But how dare anyone criticize Bo on one of those Badger boards? Sorry, Bo isn't perfect. He has flaws just like every other coach does.

Guess what. The same is true of Buzz. I respect Buzz as a coach. He has earned every MU fan's respect, appreciation, and gratitude. But Buzz is not perfect. Buzz is not above criticism. And if this board ever embraces the kind of reverent adulation for Buzz that Badger boards do for Bo, then this site will become as offensive as those Badger boards are.

I do not think the season is over, by any means. But today was the perfect opportunity to give Johnson and Dawson some decent minutes in the second half. We looked awful. We played awful. We were down by double digits and going nowhere.

The freshmen should have been given a chance. I'd rather lose by 25 and have them gain some experience against top-quality competition than lose by 17 and have them sit on the bench the entire game. And yes, I think Buzz made a mistake by not playing them at all. If he plays them only against the Gramblings and Southerns, when are they going to get the experience needed when we play New Mexico, Wisconsin, and Big East competition?

And I do honestly believe that if Derrick and Jake get the kind of minutes they had today the remainder of the season, we are in trouble.


It's Jake that needs to sit. Not Derrick. Derrick has real potential and some upside. Derrick needs confidence and needs to become a leader. Other than that, you are right about most thing you say.

[GOMU1104]

Well good thing we know the season is over. Don't have to waste the time/money watching.

Does this mean you'll retire from the boards till April, Phantom?

[Phantom Warrior]

You need some help with respect to reading comprehension. I quote: "I do not think the season is over by any means..." I also said, "IF Derrick and Jake get the kind of minutes they had today the remainder of the season, we are in trouble." The key word in that adverb clause is "IF."

[bleedbluegold03]

Couldn't. Agree. More.

A lot of this board is starting to sound blinded much like some packer fans with "in Ted I trust."

Buzz has admitted before that he's a young coach and has made mistakes, so let's not pretend today was part of some grand master plan. There was probably no chance at a victory today but the fact he didn't give the freshmen minutes when clearly nothing was working was concerning.

Juan, Jake and Derrick are all probably very nice gentlemen but have NO business getting major minutes for a "conf title" worthy program. Jake and Derrick went 1-14. I hope Buzz realize that stupid ******* experiment is over. Take your lumps with JuJuan because He literally could do nothing worse than the crap he gave today.

Could some one please, please, please craft a defense for Jake at this point? I just don't get it.

[warriorfan4life]

Jajuan was lost defensively against Grambling. Even though we played a lot of zone today (which Jajuan mostly played in high school), I understand why he got DNP-CD. Mayo has had enough success previously to where he can recover from an offensive stinker. Jajuan going 0-6 and getting lost defensively does not help his confidence. He will gradually get more PT as the year goes on and likely become a star here, but he was not ready for PT today. Aaron Craft played all 40, and would have eaten John Dawson alive. Burton got a few minutes, and will provide energy all year. Buzz brings freshman along slowly, but his player development is phenomenal and I think this class will do great things in time. In time is the key phrase there. Now, we have some upperclassmen transitioning into new roles and fans no patience to let that happen.

[Halo]

It's one game. It was a crap game all around. Buzz apologized to the fans on his post game show.

Phantom-aren't you the one always pumping these incoming freshmen in like they are future NBA'ers? I am not sure why you are upset as you are the one that sets the crazy expectations just about more than anyone.

It's a long season. At least it wasn't against Grambling. Buzz will get it turned around. He has before and until he doesn't, I am not going to doubt him.

[warriorfan4life]

Couldn't. Agree. More.

A lot of this board is starting to sound blinded much like some packer fans with "in Ted I trust."

Buzz has admitted before that he's a young coach and has made mistakes, so let's not pretend today was part of some grand master plan. There was probably no chance at a victory today but the fact he didn't give the freshmen minutes when clearly nothing was working was concerning.

Juan, Jake and Derrick are all probably very nice gentlemen but have NO business getting major minutes for a "conf title" worthy program. Jake and Derrick went 1-14. I hope Buzz realize that stupid ******* experiment is over. Take your lumps with JuJuan because He literally could do nothing worse than the crap he gave today.

Could some one please, please, please craft a defense for Jake at this point? I just don't get it.

We were tied at the half and outplayed OSU in the first half. Buzz's game plan was a big part of that. OSU hit another gear in the second half that we cannot match yet. The freshmen would not have stemmed that tide.

[mufansince72]

It's Jake that needs to sit. Not Derrick. Derrick has real potential and some upside. Derrick needs confidence and needs to become a leader. Other than that, you are right about most thing you say.

I don't agree. I think they both need to sit. I see very little upside in Derrick.

[MUMac]

One of the things I can't stand about some of the Badger Lunatics is there "Bo is god/Bo can do no wrong" nonsense. Bo is an excellent coach who has had amazing results. But how dare anyone criticize Bo on one of those Badger boards? Sorry, Bo isn't perfect. He has flaws just like every other coach does.

Guess what. The same is true of Buzz. I respect Buzz as a coach. He has earned every MU fan's respect, appreciation, and gratitude. But Buzz is not perfect. Buzz is not above criticism. And if this board ever embraces the kind of reverent adulation for Buzz that Badger boards do for Bo, then this site will become as offensive as those Badger boards are.

I do not think the season is over, by any means. But today was the perfect opportunity to give Johnson and Dawson some decent minutes in the second half. We looked awful. We played awful. We were down by double digits and going nowhere.

The freshmen should have been given a chance. I'd rather lose by 25 and have them gain some experience against top-quality competition than lose by 17 and have them sit on the bench the entire game. And yes, I think Buzz made a mistake by not playing them at all. If he plays them only against the Gramblings and Southerns, when are they going to get the experience needed when we play New Mexico, Wisconsin, and Big East competition?

And I do honestly believe that if Derrick and Jake get the kind of minutes they had today the remainder of the season, we are in trouble.

Woe partner. Be consistent here. Try to stay with us with your rants. Your first rant took everyone on this board to task and trashed every key player. Now you mention your frustration with the badger board saying bo is god and insinuating that is being done here. You follow that up with a comment specific to two players and that the frosh should play more.

Now, from your initial diatribe to this response, one person mentioned to trust Buzz. One. One, no more than one. No one said Buzz is god. One person said to trust Buzz.

I am having a really hard time understanding the purpose of your first attack and this response. Really strange. Bizarre comes to mind.

[Phantom Warrior]

Halo,

Actually, I have been bullish on Duane Wilson for months. I stated last spring I thought he should get 24-25 mpg whether he started or not. I also stated I thought he has the most diversified offensive game of any point guard I've seen come into MU in the past 50 years, and I hold to that statement. No other point guard I've seen in 50+ years has as diverse an offensive skill set as Duane has.

I have never said anything about any frosh being future NBAers or all-conference players. Period. I thought Junior would be a terrific point guard, and I thought he would start as a frosh. Due to his Achilles injury his first year, we'll never know if he would have ended up being the starter. His career ended up being less than I had anticipated, but I never predicted greatness for him.

I also said I was extremely impressed by Jerel and thought he would start ahead of Mason; then Mason left, but I was right about Jerel - he averaged 11 ppg as a frosh and ended up being first team all-Big East and second team A-A as a senior.

I also stated I thought this year's freshmen have the potential to end up being a better class than the Amigos (plus Burke).

In short, you are exaggerating any prior comments I've made about incoming freshmen. I had doubts about Vander; I had doubts about Maymon; I had doubts about EWill; I had doubts about Jamail. I said I thought Juan had excellent court vision and was an excellent passer - which I thought was the strongest part of his game.

Oh yeah, I also stated several years ago I thought Mbakwe would be a terrific player at MU. He did end up a terrific player, just not at MU.

So go ahead and misrepresent what I've said in the past if it makes you feel better. I am extremely bullish on Duane; it's a shame his career has to begin with an injury. I also think both Deonte and JaJuan will end having solid careers at MU, and I'd like to see both average double-digit mpg as frosh.

[ge1974]

Phantom, if anyone should be pissed its me. I drove all the way from the Detroit area for this game with the Wingman. And I HATE Ohio State. Although disappointed, I am not pissed. Unlike some , I did not see any lack of effort; rather just HORRIBLE execution. I heard Buzz apoligize on the post-game radio show, as well, although he didn't have to, IMO. The season is a marathon, not a sprint. I do agree with some of your original comments (and Duane Wilson) but these are college kids. This game will be a learning experience, chock-full of information about our team going forward for Buzz and staff to make improvements. It was a very fun atmosphere pre-game and during the first half. The students were loud and very engaged until the Ohio State run in the early second half.

[Phantom Warrior]

ge1974,

I'm not pissed. I am disappointed that down 16 points with six minutes left, and down 20 points with five minutes left, Buzz chose not to play any of the freshmen. Overall, I'm not disappointed with the team's effort. The defense was horrible the first few minutes of the second half when OSU got lay up after lay up, but other than that stretch I thought we played hard.

[Phantom Warrior]

MUMac,

What's not to get? Purpose of my original points? Here it is.

Many posters have expressed the view that we won't miss Vander because Todd would take a step or two forward and be a consistent player. Does he appear to have improved significantly since last season to you? I expressed serious reservations about Todd for this season and was criticized as being negative.

Many posters have expressed the view that Jamil would be our next Lazar, Jimmy, or Jae - al of whom had terrific senior seasons. I expressed serious doubts about Jamil becoming the type of player those three did as seniors and was told I was a pessimist. Has Jamil showed you anything so far to indicate he will have the type of season those players had when they were seniors?

Many posters have expressed the view that Derrick would improve offensively once he was given the reins to the team. I expressed the view that the odds of Derrick improving on the offensive end were minimal and was told I had to have faith. Does 11% from the field and 25% from the line show improvement to you?

Many posters were bullish on Juan, saying that since he was healthy over the spring and summer and fall we would see the "real Juan" and he would really step up his game. I was skeptical we would see anything more than moderate improvement from Juan this season, especially offensively. Juan does look quicker and smoother and more confident, but have you seen anything to indicate any significant upgrade in his performance?

And then there's Jake. Quite a few posters expressed the view that Jake will be a solid contributor this year, that his shooting woes last year would be behind him. I hoped that would be the case but was skeptical, though I did not express my skepticism. We finally come up against a high-major team, and Jake goes 0 for 7, including several misses when he was open and had good looks.

Several posters have been maintaining that our #17 pre-season rank was legitimate; some even felt it was too low. Most posters expect us to win conference or at least end up in the top three and get an invite to the Big Dance.

My original point? Many posters viewed this roster through blue and gold tinted glasses. Optimism is great. Wishful thinking is wonderful. But this team has some serious flaws that quite a few posters chose to ignore or overlook.

You accuse me of "trashing" Todd, Jamil, Derrick, Jake, and Juan. Really? I did not trash anybody. I think many posters' expectations for them were overly optimistic and unrealistic. Each may have a few games in which they achieve those expectations, but I will be extremely surprised if any of them show the kind of improvement many seemed to anticipate on a consistent basis. They are what they are.

As for my "rant" about Buzz not playing the freshmen when we were down by 16 with six minutes left and down 20 with five minutes left, yes, I found that very disappointing and still do.

[TheSultan]

Yes Phantom. We should all just realize that you are a genius.

[Phantom Warrior]

Man, are you missing the point!

[TheSultan]

I'm not missing anything. You spent five paragraphs on what a great, critical eye you have on the team...and the rest of the posters are wearing "sunglasses."

We get it. You are level-headed and balanced, and the rest of us aren't.

[MUMac]

I'm not missing anything. You spent five paragraphs on what a great, critical eye you have on the team...and the rest of the posters are wearing "sunglasses."

We get it. You are level-headed and balanced, and the rest of us aren't.

+1 More that a little over the top, if you ask me. He insulted most of the posters, trashed most of the players, yet put himself of a pedestal. I guess there is no reason for any of us to post. We will just have to wait for the great one's next analysis.

[mufansince72]

Can't argue much with Phantom's analysis.

[TheSultan]

Can't argue much with Phantom's analysis.

After three games?

LOL...ok...

[Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77"]

After three games last year, there were plenty wishing Todd would come back to take Vander's position.

Vander grew into his role last year and Jamil could still do the same.

Anyone that doesn't think Derrick has improved offensively is blind or didn't watch him last year.

Jake still can't find the basket in a real game. I'll give you that.

Let's face the facts:

Dawson likely is less ready than DeWil to be a high-major starter.

Jake gets it on defense, and defense is what earns minutes for Buzz.

Vander wasn't an all-conference player in November either.

Trent Lockett seemed like a massive disappointment last year too.

We praise Burton for bringing energy and attitude off the bench, yet criticize Anderson for doing the same :confused:

Buzz has had disappointing non-con losses in each of the past 5 years that had us panicking (Florida, Vandy, UW at home, NC State, Dayton) and somehow we ended up having a successful year.



Quite simply...lighten up. The sky is not falling, that's just a bit of hail.

[mufansince72]

After three games?

LOL...ok...

His analysis was over several years and he gave opinions on players. I can't argue with that analysis. It only took me two games against bad teams that I have seen in person to know we were in trouble at the PG position.