Timing is Everything?

[Goose85]

With the new conference being solidified, the next step is who the last three added will be.

Butler has parlayed some great timing with recent tourney success into moves from the Horizon League - to A-10 to Big East in two years.

Does the timing of St. Louis's successful season this year help their push to get into the Big East? I think yes.

Does the timing of Creighton's winning a NCAA tourney game last year, being ranked this year, and looking (according to braketology) at a 9 seed this year help them? I think yes.

ND - If we add them for a year, could the timing be right for a longer term association if the ACC has some defections (should find out more as Maryland's departure is finalized)?

Dayton has struggled, and is really having a down year. Will that timing affect them? While the conference is a long term proposal, I think initial perceptions of the conference will be important, so with that being said, I think the down year really hurts their chances.

VCU / Richmond - who knows?

[IWB]

Just posted in another thread, but this is a good example....

Looking at what you wrote about Butler and Creighton are true, but.....

Saint Louis is ranked and on the upswing, Dayton is in the A-10 cellar, yet Dayton seems to have more support than Saint Louis, why?

VCU has been hot in recent years, been to a Final Four and is ranked now, and Richmond is in the A-10 cellar, yet Richmond seems to have more support than VCU, why?

[TheSultan]

I think you have to be wary of the "timing" issue, both positively and negatively. I think the most important item is the willingness to invest in the basketball program, and a history of making a wise use of that investment. Creighton, Butler and Xavier meet those criteria the best. They have each had sustained success with multiple coaches over the last decade.

OTOH, Dayton hasn't done much of anything. I don't know a lot about Richmond. And while St. Louis has made such investments, Little Murs over on Scoop wrote the following which IMO cause me some concern:

"I really like SLU, but I am very concerned about where their program is going. Right now they are running on gas that Majerus put in the tank. Next year, they're running on fumes. After that, it could get scary. Biondi, the president, is fighting for his job and the BOT is preoccupied with figuring out a way to save him. (The BOT - being hand picked by Biondi over the last 25 years - is the only part of the University that wants Biondi to stay.)

Crews is coaching great, but he's still only the interim HC, a job he didn't really want and only took so that Rick could have the job back had his health worked out. Crews was out of college basketball, and only came back to be an assistant for Rick. So, its up in the air whether Crews gets offered the job, and whether he takes it if it is offered to him. If Crews is the new HC, there would be serious concern about whether he could recruit well enough to keep SLU relevant. (Recruiting is reported to be his Achilles heel). Their recruiting class for next year is one very mediocre SG. This is SLU's chance to build off their success this year and last year to recruit some solid classes, and it's slipping away. In the late 90's, SLU was were Creighton is today, ranking in the top ten of the NCAA in attendance. Then Spoonhour retired and SLU started a slide into basketball oblivion which wasn't reversed until they hired Majerus. This spring will determine whether history will repeat itself, and SLU will have to make a lot of smart moves while simultaneously dealing with the "Biondi must go" mess. I'm not optimistic."

[IWB]

SLU should hire Brian Wardle.

[warriorfan4life]

SLU should hire Brian Wardle.

Not sure if Wardle is ready for a high-major job, but I agree with the thought of hiring a young up and comer and not retaining Crews.

[IWB]

At this point I wouldn't think SLU is a high major job, but if they make the jump they would have to be.

[MUBasketball]

Saint Louis should also look at Michael White, who is doing a hell of a job at Louisiana Tech.

[Goose85]

Just posted in another thread, but this is a good example....

Looking at what you wrote about Butler and Creighton are true, but.....

Saint Louis is ranked and on the upswing, Dayton is in the A-10 cellar, yet Dayton seems to have more support than Saint Louis, why?

VCU has been hot in recent years, been to a Final Four and is ranked now, and Richmond is in the A-10 cellar, yet Richmond seems to have more support than VCU, why?

I think SLU and VCU are better shots for NCAA tourney inclusion in the next few years than Richmond and Dayton. I don't get Richmond / Dayton.

I also think that NCAA appearances and credits will be important as the new Big East will have no credits built up, so no steady stream of NCAA income.

[TedBaxter]

At this point I wouldn't think SLU is a high major job, but if they make the jump they would have to be.

If Crews doesn't want the job, the first guy I call to gauge his interest, after the Vanderbilt AD of course, is Kevin Stallings. Vanderbilt is a tough job in a hard conference to compete in and Stallings grew up across the river from St. Louis in Collinsville. Stallings may see this as a challenge worth pursuing.

[Litehouse]

Looking at this long term is difficult. A few years ago everyone would have been mentioning St. Joes when they were having their great run. Will Creighton stay this hot after Doug McDermott leaves? Will Greg stick around there after Doug is gone? What will happen with the coaching situation at SLU? Will someone give Stevens or Smart an offer they can't refuse? Are there enough viable options out west to eventually expand and include some friends for Gonzaga?

[IWB]

I doubt Villanova would want St. Joe's.

McDermott will stick around, when he was hired at Creighton they signed him to a 10 year deal. His kid being as good as he is was an unexpected surprise.

[Goose85]

Looking at this long term is difficult. A few years ago everyone would have been mentioning St. Joes when they were having their great run. Will Creighton stay this hot after Doug McDermott leaves? Will Greg stick around there after Doug is gone? What will happen with the coaching situation at SLU? Will someone give Stevens or Smart an offer they can't refuse? Are there enough viable options out west to eventually expand and include some friends for Gonzaga?

Will a move to the Big East help schools keep coaches? Will coaches like McDermott / Smart be more willing to stay put if Creighton / VCU were to be added to the conference? Would SLU going to Big East help them attract what would be perceived as a better coach.

I think the Big East would help these schools with retaining their current coaches.

[MKE_GoldenEagleFan]

That's the question though, will McDermott be any good once his kid leaves? Has he shown he can recruit anyone other than his kid?

As for Wardle to St. Louis I'm just not sure that Wardle has shown enough at UWGB to score a promotion. He needs to win the Horizon league before he can think about that. Now that Butlers gone that's an easier task.

[TheSultan]

That's the question though, will McDermott be any good once his kid leaves? Has he shown he can recruit anyone other than his kid?

He won a lot at Northern Iowa....Iowa State? Not so much.

That being said, if you look at the alternatives, Creighton IMO is a shoo-in....right behind Xavier and Dayton.

[MKE_GoldenEagleFan]

Yes and Creighton in this new league will be much closer to an Iowa State type job than a Northern Iowa type job. He needs to recruit at the high major level.

[TrevorCandelino]

Just posted in another thread, but this is a good example....

Looking at what you wrote about Butler and Creighton are true, but.....

Saint Louis is ranked and on the upswing, Dayton is in the A-10 cellar, yet Dayton seems to have more support than Saint Louis, why?

VCU has been hot in recent years, been to a Final Four and is ranked now, and Richmond is in the A-10 cellar, yet Richmond seems to have more support than VCU, why?

So Georgetown doesnt want to have to recruit against VCU/Shaka Smart and would prefer Richmond.....BUt who is afraid of recruiting against SLU?

[IWB]

I don't think anyone is afraid of recruiting against SLU, I think SLU's problem is that no one in the BB-7 is saying, "We need SLU!" They have no champion on the inside fighting on their behalf.

[Goose85]

I would prefer VCU and Creighton over Richmond and Dayton.

We are already losing games with Louisville, UConn, Syracuse, Pitt and I'd hate to replace those with games against Richmond and Dayton, both in danger of not making A-10 tournament (only top 12 teams in the conference go to the conference tournament).

[TulsaWarrior]

I was skeptical at first but now believe Danny Manning has the makings of a high major coach. He is in the first year at Tulsa after a number of years as a Kansas assistant. The Golden Hurricane are slightly over .500 on the season. That is a miracle with no size and little experience among the returning players. As far as Brian Wardle at Green Bay -- he has proven to be a good recruiter but the jury is out as far as in game coaching. Next season should tell the story. He will have a 7-1 NBA center with a shot at the NBA, a lightning quick undersized point guard and several athletic 6-8 forwards.